[Resolved] Submitting A Form

BrentNorin

Ok I want to know if there are any other ways to submit a form (html <form>) other than the input/submit button system. The reason I want this is I would like more of a link interface. So like can the <a> tag be used to send all the form information somewhere?

goldbug

You can use a normal anchor to submit a form, but that requires the use of javascript, which is easily disabled.

Another way is using the input/image type, but that's functionally very similar to a standard submit button. In theory, you could specify whatever text you wanted in the alt attribute, point the src attribute at an invalid URL, and it should just show the alt text (which should work like a link... in theory--keep in mind I've not actually tried this.)\

Edit: NM, just tested the following:

<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.0 Strict//EN" "http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/DTD/xhtml1-strict.dtd">
<html xmlns="http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml" xml:lang="en" >
<head>
<title>Link submit</title>
</head>
<body>

<form method="get" action="#">
<p>
  <input type="image" alt="This link should submit" src="completelyinvalidurl.gif" />
  <input type="hidden" name="testvar" value="true" />
</p>
</form>

</body>
</html>

...It works beautifully in Firefox, but in IE, it shows a disgusting image not found placeholder with the alt text inside.... not the desired effect. Oh well, I tried 🙂

BrentNorin

So you have no solution for me. Thanks anyways. 😃

Let me restate what I am trying to do.

I have a news page, with 10 entries extracted from mySQL. With each it has a name (the subject) and an autoincremental number attached to it. Now when an admin is logged in, he needs the ability to edit or delete one of those. So now I can a) use a link with the variables attached to the end to open up the page for news editing, or b) use hidden fields in a form and have the button open the page.

Now what am I to do? I dont want the appending to the url, and I dont like buttons. This seems to me like a major barrier. I could set a session, but for 10 news entries that adds up.
lol why cant I just use $_POST['id'] = whateveriwant

Weedpacket

I forget; how good is IE at styling buttons?

Okay, it can do that. Ish. Kinda. Maybe if you thumped it a bit more.

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN">

<html>
<head>
<title>Untitled</title>
<style type="text/css">
<!--
.spunky{
	background-color:white;
   color:blue;
   text-decoration:underline;
   margin:0;
   border:0;
   padding:0;
-->
</style>
</head>
<body>
This may be of some interest: <input type="button" class="spunky"
	value="You got something for me, Mr. Hammersmith?"
   onclick="javascript:alert('NO!')">
</body>
</html>

BrentNorin

Yeah I guess that serves my purpose but for the idea of simplicity this is really a wall when working with PHP I think.

vaaaska

Originally posted by BrentNorin
and I dont like buttons.

Get over it then.

I use images or links all the time in lieu of "buttons" if that's what you mean. But you still need to have a form in action (I believe).

goldbug

Originally posted by BrentNorin
So you have no solution for me. Thanks anyways. 😃

Let me restate what I am trying to do.

I have a news page, with 10 entries extracted from mySQL. With each it has a name (the subject) and an autoincremental number attached to it. Now when an admin is logged in, he needs the ability to edit or delete one of those. So now I can a) use a link with the variables attached to the end to open up the page for news editing, or b) use hidden fields in a form and have the button open the page.

Now what am I to do? I dont want the appending to the url, and I dont like buttons. This seems to me like a major barrier. I could set a session, but for 10 news entries that adds up.
lol why cant I just use $_POST['id'] = whateveriwant

In this case, if it's a limited set of people that are going to be accessing such functionality, there's nothing wrong with requiring that small subset of users to have javascript enabled (enough to submit via a link). If they want to use said admin functionality, they've gotta have JS on 😃

vaaaska

Originally posted by goldbug
In this case, if it's a limited set of people that are going to be accessing such functionality, there's nothing wrong with requiring that small subset of users to have javascript enabled (enough to submit via a link). If they want to use said admin functionality, they've gotta have JS on 😃

Yes, but that would be bad usability. Jakob Nielsen says... 😉

I agree - javascript. Require it and don't allow access (via PHP) if they don't have it enabled.

goldbug

Jakob Nielsen is a crotchety old man, living in 1999, preaching ideals that in practice, rarely work; ignoring the fact that aesthetics seem to have no place in his idea of a "usable" web. 😃

-- And technically, you can code in some fallback method that is overridden (sp?) by javascript events if they do have it enabled 🙂

Sgarissta

Originally posted by BrentNorin
Yeah I guess that serves my purpose but for the idea of simplicity this is really a wall when working with PHP I think.

It's not a wall when working with PHP, it's a wall when working with HTML. HTML only provides two methods for submitting a form (with a method of POST mind you), a button or an image.

The alternative is not to use a form at all, and just use one hell of a query string on each of your links. It makes it link based, and removes the need for javascript.

goldbug

Can't remember where I first saw/read it, but a good thing to keep in mind (seeing how it sort-of applies to this conversation):

Links take you to a new location
Buttons make the application act on data

Links performing actions could end up providing ambiguity for the end user.

BrentNorin

Well this thread exploded. I got what I need, thanks.

pohopo

I believe I have a solution (I am still new to PHP)...

In your link you put something like href='page.php?action=delete&key=1234'.
In page.php you have a function that looks for action=delete. When it see this function it will run and delete your record based on key. At the end of the function you reload/redirect the page where you remove 'action=delete&key=1234'.

no need for javascript or form. for this to work you need to have the output buffer on. (ob_start and ob_end_flush).

BrentNorin

Thats kindof what I was trying not to do I think, but thats another idea. IF you can execute the code fast enough and change page, heh the users will never catch it. 😉

Weedpacket

Originally posted by goldbug
Jakob Nielsen is a crotchety old man, living in 1999, preaching ideals that in practice, rarely work; ignoring the fact that aesthetics seem to have no place in his idea of a "usable" web. 😃

His site is as pleasant to look at as a Soviet-era housing estate. "Hey, it's usable - what more do you want?"

Weedpacket

Originally posted by BrentNorin
Yeah I guess that serves my purpose but for the idea of simplicity this is really a wall when working with PHP I think.

I'd've thought the stylesheet solution would be simple enough (once that extra padding could be killed off - though that might be an advantage). The result is something that acts (exactly) like a button and looks (almost exactly - but improvements are possible) like a link. If all the buttons on the page styled the same then the only change needed would be to add the style declaration (you are using stylesheets already, aren't you)?

Er, unless the problem is "how can I get buttons to submit the form contents"...? 😕

As usual, it works As Expected in Firefox....
In fact, the style declaration is even easier in Firefox, because the selector can be made more accurate than in IE.

Still and all though; that conceptual difference between buttons and links is not something to be ignored completely.

BrentNorin

The solution is easy and I've applied it, but it still doesn't stop making me wonder why I had to go that way just to merely pass a variable or two. Just seemed pointless, but your way works! Thanks again.

Weedpacket

Originally posted by BrentNorin
The solution is easy and I've applied it, but it still doesn't stop making me wonder why I had to go that way just to merely pass a variable or two. Just seemed pointless, but your way works! Thanks again.

Ah, that's probably because you're pushing the use of an element beyond its specification. You have to expect something to give!