What languages do you know

[TrickyPhillips]

Languages that I know (In the order that I learned them):

BBCode (Hehe)
HTML
ACTool (A macro language)
Visual Basic (I no longer use Windows, so this is useless)
Java
Shell (A bit)
PHP (More than Shell, less than Java)

[BuzzLY]

I wouldn't say PHP is "less" than Java -- just different.

[pohopo]

Originally posted by BuzzLY
I wouldn't say PHP is "less" than Java -- just different.

I think he meant he just understands PHP more then Shell and Less then Java.

[TrickyPhillips]

Originally posted by pohopo
I am think he meant he just understands PHP more then Shell and Less then Java.

Hehe. Yes, that's what I meant.

'Twas my fault. Sorry to confuse you. 🙂

[leatherback]

Originally posted by BuzzLY
I wouldn't say PHP is "less" than Java -- just different.

I prefer Java, I think. Sunshine, cold drink and a bit of scuba diving.. Or programming? hm.. easy choice!

J

[justsomeone]

some of the more obscure stuff I have developed in in the past - either for fun, profit or education

VAX Assembler
Modula 2
Turbopascal
ZPL
postscript & PDF (if you're going to count HTML, then I'm going to count handcoding these babies :p )
awk
prolog
deplhi

and the first linux distro I experimented with was Yggdrasil!

Nowadays, the dayjob doesn't involve any programming, though they do like to bring in the "old man" once in a while for troubleshooting. I tinker about a lot in my own time on a few hobby site or casual earners, and that's mostly (but not exclusively) PHP / C.

[dalecosp]

Originally posted by Weedpacket
See also
http://www.phpbuilder.com/board/showthread.php?s=&threadid=10216991
(Anyone else disturbed that I can remember that far back?)

Only slightly. That was my first thought, too: "OMG, did we leave a poll open again??"

Since that previous thread, I've mucked around in C and in sh. I've written in BASIC prior to Elizabeth's "hozibag" days, but that's about it....

I'm still not a programmer, I think. At least, I never get any done, it seems.

[cyberlew15]

Smashing point on the languages also C/C++ from when I was younger was so much different as just like php the languages are evolving. but anyway I with occasional reference to tutorials/ tips / manuals write PHP, Actionscript, Lingo, C/C++, Java & Mobile Phone Java, Assembler for x86, Gamecube and Ps2(with heavy reference to tutorials), HTML/XHTML(Not W3C compliant ooh), CSS, JavaScript, ASP, PERL, Various forms of basic, SHell script, DOS Batch, Delphi, Indigo Rose Scripting thingy for interactive CD Menus, Yarooze and Photoshop / PSP scripting.

Real challenge would be writing all of these fluently with no help and still complying to coding standards

Has anyone else noticed that people with bad grammar such as myself have sloppy code. 🙁

[Weedpacket]

Originally posted by cyberlew15
Has anyone else noticed that people with bad grammar such as myself have sloppy code. 🙁

Eric S. Raymond has commented on the subject:

Being a native English-speaker does not guarantee that you have language skills good enough to function as a hacker. If your writing is semi-literate, ungrammatical, and riddled with misspellings, many hackers (including me) will tend to ignore you. While sloppy writing does not invariably mean sloppy thinking, we've generally found the correlation to be strong — and we have no use for sloppy thinkers. If you can't yet write competently, learn to.

[cyberlew15]

Nice One Bruv But I'm not saying I cant't spell I'm saying sometimes I write code that could be more efficient and I'msaying thereis a link between this and my terrible English speaking grammar.

Also you really should not quote that guy he's a frikin moron i mean how clever can he be if he openly admits to hacking which is illegal in most civilised countries.:o

[BuzzLY]

No.

[soapbox]
Cracking is wrong and illegal. Hacking is simply a slang term that means skillful coding. Unfortunately, it's being used more and more (usually by those that are NOT hackers) to mean using those skills to illegally break into networks, spread viruses, crack phone systems, etc.

There is even a Hacker Ethic that forbids the typical activities of a cracker.

If you would read Eric's Jargon File, you would see a chapter on Crackers, Phreaks, and Lamers, demonstrating that he too knows the difference between a true hacker and a cracker.

Let us all give thanks to the media for blurring the line between the two. At least we in the geek community know the difference, and can point those few wayward souls that have forgotten in the right direction.
[/soapbox]

[cyberlew15]

just because you do not change a file or cause destruction you still have no rights to take apart someones work and the tools such as soft ICE which hackers may use to observe programs donot make them skillful programmers a skillful programmer is just that and does not need to observe others work for inspiration or insight

[dalecosp]

"Hackers" don't reverse engineer commercial software. Not it they're really true to the ethic.

Once again, you seem to have meant to say "the tools such as soft ICE which crackers may use to observe programs" ... did you check the link BuzzLY gave you?

[BuzzLY]

Originally posted by cyberlew15
just because you do not change a file or cause destruction you still have no rights to take apart someones work and the tools such as soft ICE which hackers may use to observe programs donot make them skillful programmers

Agreed, except you should have used the term crackers there. Please re-read my post, and try opening your mind to the possibility that someone else might know what they're talking about. And as long as you are going to criticize others, please learn how to use punctuation. That way, when you do have a point worth considering, others will take you more seriously.

a skillful programmer is just that and does not need to observe others work for inspiration or insight

Um, wrong. Inspiration usually comes from some external stimuli, such as others' code. Insight is not a requirement for skill, and can be externally stimulated. For example: Weedpacket may post something that solves a problem I've been working on in a much more elegant way. In the future, I'll remember what he did, and hopefully learn from it. There is nothing wrong with that.

If he copyrights it, and encrypts it, and puts a note in his license agreement that I shouldn't reverse-engineer the code, then I won't do that. But as long as the source is available to me, I'll look it over as much as I want, and learn from it. That is how we grow and learn as programmers.

[dalecosp]

Originally posted by BuzzLY
If he copyrights it, and encrypts it, and puts a note in his license agreement that I shouldn't reverse-engineer the code, then I won't do that. But as long as the source is available to me, I'll look it over as much as I want, and learn from it. That is how we grow and learn as programmers.

And this is why "open source" is a very, very, very good thing ....

[Weedpacket]

I'll give another quote from the introduction (and provide the link again, because cyberlew15 missed it the first time around):

There is another group of people who loudly call themselves hackers, but aren't. These are people (mainly adolescent males) who get a kick out of breaking into computers and phreaking the phone system. Real hackers call these people ‘crackers’ and want nothing to do with them. Real hackers mostly think crackers are lazy, irresponsible, and not very bright, and object that being able to break security doesn't make you a hacker any more than being able to hotwire cars makes you an automotive engineer. Unfortunately, many journalists and writers have been fooled into using the word ‘hacker’ to describe crackers; this irritates real hackers no end.

The basic difference is this: hackers build things, crackers break them.

[mtmosier]

Originally posted by dalecosp
"Hackers" don't reverse engineer commercial software. Not it they're really true to the ethic.

Exactly. Reverse engineering is wrong. That's why we all use authentic IBM PCs instead of those evil clones.

[planetsim]

Originally posted by mtmosier
Exactly. Reverse engineering is wrong. That's why we all use authentic IBM PCs instead of those evil clones.

So what does hardware have to do with Software? I see nothing wrong with PCs other than authentic IBM ones, its called competition, and healthy competition at that.

[mtmosier]

Originally posted by planetsim
So what does hardware have to do with Software? I see nothing wrong with PCs other than authentic IBM ones, its called competition, and healthy competition at that.

So competition is good, but only as long as you limit it to hardware?

[cyberlew15]

Atno poin did I say that they looked at open source code it's a given that that is acceptable but taking codethat is not their own whether it is to merely observe the codeis wrong.

a lot of windows bugs are found by real hackers which to some may sound useful but the "Crackers" use this information so it is wrong to do so. Also by the way I stated that my grammar is bad and inherently a subset of grammar is punctuation. also to innovate is to create something completelynew so no it is not done fromother peoples code. for example If i build my own bike wheel that is not innovation but rather creation.

I'mnot saying hackers are destructive I'm saying there like oldladies nitpicking at code that they have no rights to spy on. If they want toi look at code andfind problems they should become debuggers for majour software companies

In short they indirectly through their knowledge enable others to do serious harm. I'mnot saying they should'nt existI'm simply stating that they don't do any real good. Also someone that invents software is klnown as a software engineer not a hacker.