PHP Dev's Salary

navster

I've been working as a PHP web developer at a small/medium marketing agency for about a year now in the UK. I'm fresh-ish out of college (that’s just normal college - not uni) after doing a vocational subject in IT. Didn't cover any web programming there so I've pretty much taught myself PHP/MySQL.

I'm the only web developer in the company - plus the only 'techie' - so I've been assigned pretty much every IT job title under the sun - as no one else knows anything when it comes to computers!! :rolleyes:

So my annual review is coming up and I'm a bit unsure when it comes to my salary and how much I should be earning. How much should a 20 year old be looking at as a web developer with 1 year commercial experience with 5+ as a hobby? Plus of course all the additional support/networking jobs that I have to complete on a regular basis.

Will look forward to your advice.

Shrike

There are so many things to consider that putting a figure on it is quite difficult. Web developer salaries range from 10k to 50k and upwards a year depending on the role, the company, the location as well as the employees experience. I think salaries for a PHP developer, not in a senior role, should range from 15 to 30k. But don't quote me 😉

jazz_snob

I'm the only web developer in the company - plus the only 'techie' - so I've been assigned pretty much every IT job title under the sun - as no one else knows anything when it comes to computers!!

Cool, job security! Take that into consideration when making up a number. I think $20/hr USD is a good low figure, don't you? Aim high! Depends on how hard it would be to replace you. I work per-project and try to guess how long it might take then charge about $20/hr.

Drakla

The average for a contractor in the 'outer London' area is £31 an hour according to the most recent surveys. Londonjobs.co.uk which I used to look at never had a job that paid less that 28 thousand a year for php developers. Php juniors get 25 - 35 an hour and seniors 35 - 65 an hour according to some survey I was looking at recently, but can't remember what the source was.

bubblenut

I was on £18K for the first two years of after doing an HND. That was three or four years ago though, prices may have gone up by now. If you're up for an appraisal and you're interested in focusing on web development I would try to push for a clarification of your role. Of course, if the company is small you may not have much leyway there.
A friend sent me a link a while ago (I think it was done by computer weekly) to a questionaire which helped quide you on your salary, I'll try to find it. However, everything has to be taken in the context of the company you're working for. Another good place to look is on job sites, I regularly check jobserve.com, not because I'm looking for a new job, but just to see what's being offered around the place.

Jason_Batten

I strongly believe that web developers are being cut short when it comes to pay. More so by companies who want to hire a web developer who they expect knows every single language under the sun for 30k/year. Not sure how it is in other countries but Australia's IT job market, okay lets just make that job market, sucks [technical term].

Anything less than $USD 45k/year is a slap in the face.

DEMAND what you are worth. This job is more difficult than sitting behind a desk eating donuts - you have to code with the other hand as well :o

bubblenut

Jason Batten wrote:
Anything less than $USD 45k/year is a slap in the face.

DEMAND what you are worth. This job is more difficult than sitting behind a desk eating donuts - you have to code with the other hand as well :o

You cannot say that all web developers are worth $45k, I know I wasn't when I started out. To be honest I was probably more trouble than I was worth. Companies often have very little to gain from employing a complete newb in this industry (this is why most ask for at least 2-3 years experience). In fact, there are only two advantages I can think of, they cost less and they are a clean slate, ready to be tought the bad habbits and illinformed doctrine already commonlpace in the company 😉 I would agree, don't sell yourself short, but at the same time, it's pointless to oversell yourself because you just won't get a job. Price yourself correctly.

AbusiveWombat

Jason Batten wrote:
I strongly believe that web developers are being cut short when it comes to pay. More so by companies who want to hire a web developer who they expect knows every single language under the sun for 30k/year. Not sure how it is in other countries but Australia's IT job market, okay lets just make that job market, sucks [technical term].

Anything less than $USD 45k/year is a slap in the face.

DEMAND what you are worth. This job is more difficult than sitting behind a desk eating donuts - you have to code with the other hand as well :o

I completely agree. I've just recently started to look into switching careers from a position in hardware verification to web application development. My verification position pays $69k / yr + benefits and is far easier and less demanding than web development. Do you guys realize how under paid you are? Verification only requires the knowledge of 1 programming language and a detailed mindset. Knowing a scripting language like PERL is considered overachieving. There's no worries about databases, hackers, or needing to keep up on all the latest skills.

I can't believe that someone with the knowledge and understanding of multiple languages (HTML, PHP, JavaScript, XML, SQL...etc), database systems, and security issues would even consider anything less than $50k / yr. It rediculous. As Jason stated...DEMAND what you're worth.

Shrike

If there are alot of people competing for the same jobs then the market value of the skill set goes down. Perhaps there just aren't many people available for your line of work. Oracle DBAs get paid alot and they only have to know Oracle.

Weedpacket

Employment agencies (particulary those that specialise in IT) have a pretty good idea of market rates for various positions and levels of experience. Try asking them what companies are willing to pay for someone with your skill set and experience - they've got an interest in giving you a fair idea of what you're worth even if you're not actively seeking a position through them. (I say them because it doesn't hurt to ask more than one).

vaaaska

We went through this with DavidJam once. It's all based upon the local market and what the company can afford plus get out of somebody.

If a company in NYC can find somebody to do the job for $35k they will. Of course, it's more likely that they want a skilled person and will need to pay $85k.

foid025

perhaps you should check on one of those online job sites. monster.com is the only one I have in mind really... I think it does the UK too, not just US. perhaps the best is to, once you find what you're worth, ask for a bit more, and then negotiate as you can... one thing though, you've been working for this firm for a year and you dont have a salary yet??

Jason_Batten

You cannot say that all web developers are worth $45k, I know I wasn't when I started out.

Obviously not every kid on the block. What I was saying though is that the advertised positions ask for alot and the pay doesn't match up. If you know several languages and have the experience you should be paid for it.

Weedpacket

You can demand as much as you like, but the market won't pay more than it's prepared to.

Often, the company lists everything they'll be wanting the "tech guy" to do (about three or four specialised roles conflated because it's all "IT"), and then pull a number out of nowhere based on how much money they have left after paying everyone else. When faced with the impedance mismatch, they'll likely go "...ah, maybe not," and pull the vacancy.

Jason_Batten

Half of you don't know how much you're worth and people will exploit your value if you let them.

Ask yourself, how much am I worth, then ask why 🙂 and no "because I'm smart" or "because mummy says so" are not valid answers. Be honest to yourself.

If asked "How much are you expecting to earn", what are you going to say? Are you going to say what they wrote on the ad? Or are you even going to say why you’re expecting that much?

You can demand as much as you like, but the market won't pay more than it's prepared to.

*Of course, negative people will try to come up with an excuse about some sort of "limit" or mental "wall" they see blocking the way. Anyone who says "that wont work" is a failure. The "I can’t do it, you can’t either" attitude is a classic negative minded example. Watch out!

Most people fail. Not many get back up and try again.

If you got the deeper meaning in this post, good and no it is not easy building value - knowing why and presenting your value. I'm still building my value and that’s okay because I know why I'm doing it. Why are you doing what you do? Are you building value?

*There is a point to what weedpacket says, sometimes things just dont work, sometimes you won't get what you want but does that mean you should stop trying?

Shrike

I don't want to sound harsh but how long have you been in a full time job Jason? I'm 6 years out of university now and have a fair idea of the web developer market in the UK - it is very competetive and overstaffed, particularly outside of London. Employers can pick and choose and will never pay the top end of their advertised scale because they don't have to - someone will always work for less even if they think they are worth more.

piersk

Shrike, when you say web development, do you mean the actual programming, or the general web market? Because I get loads of adverts for jobs in programming (admittedly I'm not at a stage where I can actually apply for any of them at the moment). Not necessarily in PHP, but ASP seems to be quite sought after.

However, I see the actual web design as a dead market to me. You either need to be shit-hot at design (like this) or be the 15 year old son of the CEO. And I'm neither.

Shrike

I mean actual programming. There do seem to be more ASP vacancies floating around but I don't think the pay scales are all that different for the same role. When applying for PHP jobs I got about 1 response for every 10 applications - that just being an agent calling me up, nowhere near interview stage.

Your right in that the web design market has slowed down alot. I'd credit that to the internet bubble bursting. When I started my first job the company employed 6 designers, 8 HTML authors and 2 programmers in a company of about 20 people. When I left the company employed 60 people of whom 2 were HTML authors, 3 designers and 15 programmers - the focus had shifted over the years from brand websites to web applications. Which is good for us programmers right? 🙂

navster

Thanks for your responses guys - been good looking through them all.

I'm earning £14k ~ $25k. I didn't apply for the job as such it was purly by cold calling different companies in the local area. Once I "sold" myself I was given a contract part-time (as there was hardly any web work about), this has since moved to full-time.

I'm way in the country & I was dead lucky to find this as my first job... plus its in walking distance.

The money isnt fantastic.. but I'm mainly doing it for the experience in the hope that it will help me get onto the career ladder. We all gotta start from somewhere right?

I will explain the situation & how I feel, that I'm not just developing, I also do the other IT jobs (which I should add aren’t part of my contract) in the review. In comparison I feel I should be on at least £18k if not more.

If I dont get what I want then I think its for the best to gain more experience elsewhere. There's only so much you can learn in a small marketing agency anyway!

Jason_Batten

I don't want to sound harsh but how long have you been in a full time job Jason?

I don't work. I don't have a job. I don't want one either. I never even finished high-school. I do business 😃

Getting a job is just selling yourself. Again, what do you have of value to others?

Like I said, don't waste YOUR time.

Good luck navster, grow and experience as much as possible.