Prevent user from copying the php files

Anon

Following situation comes up if someone writes a commercial application in PHP and sells it. Normally the user has physical access to the source. Unlike with binaries he sees the source code and could remove all checks from the source.

So no real limitations for an application can be built-in. I think of restricting the numbers of users, rows of data inserted,..... - anyway.

I havent found a way from preventing the user from copying/modifying the sources. Are there any methods which prevent this or make it really hard for the user to make a copy?

TIA

Anon

Isn't the idea of PHP in general open Source?

Darren

Anon

Here's a thought. Just make your software so good it doesn't need silly limits, crippling, etc. to make people pay for extra features.

I personally won't buy ANY software for my server that I can't get the source code for unless there's a pressing need and no other package can provide the same functionality.

Further you're mistaken in your belief that binaries are somehow hard to decompile and change. I started hacking binaries at 15, and could unprotect just about any piece of software in a few days time.

The real answer is service. Provide that to your customers, and they won't even look at the code, they'll look to you.

Anon

Yes, of course is PHP an open source project. But why should I give away a useful application? I think that PHP is just another way of writing applications. Not something really (but really good!!).

If a company decides to buy an application and pays for it so its unfair to another company which gets the application on an illegal way. Because one pays it and another gets a free illegal copy!

So its not really against open source. Its just a question of whats is okay and whats not. And dont tell me to put a copyright notice is enough! This notice doesnt prevent anyone from copying!

Anon

The first point (pay for features) you mention is really good.

The next point - "i dont pay for any software" - is not really taken from real life. you dont write commercial software and give it away for nothing. Take also a look at the answer of the Darren Caeys's posting.

And the last concerning binaries: I know that reverse-engeenering and decompiling is possible. I dont want a binary but I want a way to make copying as hard as possible.

Anon

You seem to be confusing source availability with software being given away for free. I didn't say I wont pay for commercial software. I pay quite a bit for commercial software. But I prefer to get it with source code. I can't tell you how many times I've been able to fix a critical service because I had the code, and how many more times I've been stuck for WEEKS waiting for someone else to fix the code because I didn't have the source.

If I have to choose between a source available but commercial package, and a no-source commercial package, even if the source available one isn't quite as high powered as the non-source available, I'll pick the source-available software.

My point is that in the current climate of change, where people are beginning more and more expect SOURCE, trying to deny them the source is gaining you little, if anything.

If you don't want them to see the code, then simply host the application on your own server.

Or, if you can't do that, write something in C++ and fastCGI, which would provide you with what you are asking for. Any kind of obfuscation scheme you cook up for PHP is just as likely to kill a server for a legitimate user as for a user that's trying to cheat the system.

P.S. Cold fusion just caused me about two hours work rebuilding a production server due it's wonderfully closed source nature. You won't get ANY sympathy from me for trying to hide your code.

I stand by my original statement, that if you make your code so good, and so useful that when the customer gets it, they won't want to mess with it, then this whole discussion becomes a moot point.

Anon

Clearly, you have great beliefs.
I stand by those too.
A good service is the real business, not just programming and hacking.

Like scots says, you and your client just have to sit over the project, you looking at him, he looking at you, delivering the BEST solution possible. The code stands beneath, and it's ony important for the developing team.

This is, if you believe you can delliver THAT kind of service and just stay above your competitors or whoever is bigbrothering your work.

The one that does this better is the best no matter how one hacks and copies him.

Nice...

André

Anon

Sorry I hardly expressed myself 🙂

All I meant was its not designed to hide the code.

We sell PHP programming all the time.

People look at the code, expand on it, send it back with new features. I can understanding you getting worried about your hard work, but if you put enough into it I am sure you will get more back and gain some respect from people.

Regards
Darren

Anon

The one that does this better is the best no >matter how one hacks and copies him.

Really? the damage to the industry caused by illegal copies is very high. so copying is not fair to company which pays for it. the company which gets a hacked version hasnt to meet expenses. so this one is more competitive.

Anon

Gottfried Szing wrote:

The one that does this better is the best no >matter how one hacks and copies him.

QUOTE
Really? the damage to the industry caused by illegal copies is very high. so copying is not fair to company which pays for it. the company which gets a hacked version hasnt to meet expenses. so this one is more competitive.

END QUOTE

Actually, I'd say the costs of downtime due to hair brained protection schemes is far higher than any due to illegal copies.

Having had more than one system that stopped working simply because of a license glitch (legally licensed software, not pirated) and having spent hours on the phone (on my own dime I might add) trying to get said poorly crafted licensing schemes to allow my legally licensed software to work, THAT's expensive.

Having to wait til monday morning when tech support will be in, the Tuesday til the person who actually understands the problem can get to it, that's VERY expensive.

I can say that I am not a problem when it comes to copying software illegally. I pay for all the software that costs money on my system(s).

Generally, copy protection schemes get in the way of only the casual copiers and legitimate users. Real pirates don't even blink at copy protection. And it's quite easy to find things like fake registration keys / serial numbers / deprotection hacks etc. on the web.

Finally, if you REALLY need to have your software be compiled and unviewable by users, you should look elsewhere, both for support (in the community sense) and to make it possible. I'd recommend C++. FastCGI is an excellent way to make a very fast web server that runs CGI C code.

But when you slowly lose customer base to the open source alternatives in PHP that have ten times the features, all happily donated by the user community, dont' come crying to us here on this board, we won't have any sympathy. Of course, if it makes you feel better to blame those problems on piracy, then go ahead and do so. I understand that's what MS claims is why sales are down so much.