PHP as a stepping stone

Anon

I often find people talking about learning PHP and they say things like "It will be easy if you already know C, C++, Perl, etc."

PHP was actually the first language I learned. I mean, I had taken classes in high school using qbasic and pascal, but I didn't really ever LEARN those languages. I'm very good at PHP now. I mostly learned by reading the manual (its very easy to understand) and a few online tutorials. No books. No classes.

I was wondering if anyone in my situation has ever gone on to another language? I'm thinking about getting into game programming but I know I need to learn C++ to do that. Would it be easy for me to master C++ after mastering PHP? Actually, thats a stupid question. Obviously it wouldn't be easy to master C++, but you know what I mean. Do you think I could go straight into it without taking any classes?

Doug

ame12

Suggestion, you may be better off starting with Java. It's pretty forgiving (you're not talking directly to the machine, so a mistake will not crash your box).

Also, Java is a great introduction to object-oriented concepts that apply directly to C++. And, as a bonus, there is a great Java tutorial at http://www.javasoft.com/docs/books/tutorial/?frontpage-spotlight - along with other more advanced workshops that can really take you a long way if you have the inclination.

To be a great C developer, I think it takes about 1 year of solid development mastering weird syntax like "LPCTSTR** pppFoo" and correctly handling memory management. And C++ takes another year of solid work IMO.

Whether you take a Java track or a C/C++ track, it would good to pick up a book on algorithms and data structures. These two are kind of the heart of any computer science curriculum.

Dave

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Anon

This is all fine uness you jump into functional languages like LISP, Haskell, or Scheme, or relational languages like Prolog. Now most people aren't going to go out and develop a game in these languages (although I've seen LISP and prolog used as part of some). These languages require a very different way of thinking.

As far as PHP being a stepping stone it's not a bad one. You'll want to get C syntax and OOP under your belt fairly early on. The big hurdles will be memory handling and Objects and linker errors. Java is another nice language to be familiar with and doesn't have quite the same problems as C. On the other hand you really need to either know OOP or be using Java to learn it from day one.

The worst thing about PHP as a stepping stone (imo) is that so many things (like string handling and output) are so easy that more tightly structured languages will seem contrained. Development time also tends to slow down. Throw in a few bizarre linker errors and you'll start wanting to beat C to death.

Anon

Man, guys prior to me gave a really terrific advice, which I've read. (Dave I might try to fool with java).

Now, Doug, as far as PHP being a stepping stone - I agree with that. So far learning PHP helped me programming structure for other languages. Currently I am undergoing self-study of C, and php experience sure does help.

My advice is this - do not take any classes at any college - that will only constrain you. All computer learning is best accomplished by self learning. If you mastered PHP without any classes, then you'll need no classes as far as C++ concerned. I am in MIS program here at U of M (senior), and all these people do is write "hello world" type of programs. If I would be going with program - I'd be pathetic when it comes to programming.

C and C++ are related so this is what I would suggest for you. Read "C programming language" by Ritchie and Kernighan. This book is only 260 pages, and it is 13 years old, but... I wish every computer book would be written in such format. It is 45 dollars, and I am not promoting for self benefit, but my advice - GET IT!!! Just read some reviews on amazon.com. These guys (Ritchie, Kernighan) did a fabulous job of writing a classic book. (a note on game programming: Quake engine is written in C).

Anon

For some reason this post came only in half. Rertying. 😉

Well... Althought java is a nice start to start at usually then I think he needs to get into C right away. I he really wants to get into game programming he needs to learn C and it would be better to start sooner than later. If he is good already in PHP he should have a good enough basis to start C-ing. No-one in the game industry uses JAVA in any form. I myself find java to be slow and boring. C is used in all games and always will be. If he wants to get into console programming he won't even have the pleasure of C++. Just plain old C. And he has to start to learn to read manuals as well(You should see those damn PSX API from Sony. It's hell).

But my advice to him is to learn C now. Although Java might be good for other things it is just useless when going in to the game business.